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Humor: TEAM to Raise Tool Prices, Effective January 20, 2009

November 7, 2008

Now that Orrin’s man lost the Presidential election on Tuesday, he’s probably calculating how much he’ll have to raise tool prices in order to recoup the money he’ll be giving to Uncle Sam if his taxes increase post January 20, 2009. In a post published the day after the election, the Supreme TEAM Leader writes:

It is historical moments like this that remind me how important it is to stand for your principles, even in the face of tyranny. In my opinion, I would rather surrender my wealth, status and life rather than surrender my principles and honor.

Tyranny? Look in the mirror, Orrin! I love how Woodward tends to frame his arguments in simplistic terms such as black and white, good and evil, and us versus them.

TEAM Members! What has Orrin really done for you? He may have given you some business advice or some communication skills, but is it worth your devotion to him? Is the money you’re pouring into MonaVie and TEAM tools really helping you succeed or stay healthy? Or is it just serving to fill the coffers of Dallin “Larceny” and Orrin Woodward, who will continue to love-bomb you so that the cycle continues again and again?

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28 Comments
  1. November 8, 2008 6:07 am

    Supposedly TEAM tool profit is limited to 50% of Mona Vie profit, making it reasonable and known. If true, that is light years ahead of the Amway tool scam.

  2. Porkchopjim permalink
    November 8, 2008 3:39 pm

    Monavie also costs a whole bunch which would make it a greatly superior ‘functional drink’ according to the strict scientific criteria offered by some proponents of overpriced ‘functional drinks’ here.

  3. November 8, 2008 7:47 pm

    I’ll bet your shrink costs a whole bunch which would make you a greatly superior “thinker” according to the strict scientific criteria offered by anyone with half a brain.

  4. Porkchopjim permalink
    November 9, 2008 1:27 pm

    Personal insults! What a shocker!

    It would be even better if it made sense.

    If you’ve don’t have facts, attack. Cult 101. The Tex Transparency Initiative.

  5. Joecool permalink
    November 10, 2008 12:17 pm

    tex, who monitors the MV tools income? Orrin?

    Let’s do the same with Amway but allow Dexter or Bill to self report their tools income. LOL

  6. November 10, 2008 2:37 pm

    jc,

    I don’t know how they monitor the profit, but I agree we shouldn’t let the fox guard the hen house.

  7. Porkchopjim permalink
    November 11, 2008 2:39 pm

    How come Orrin made only $500K selling Amway products, yet takes an even smaller group to MonaVie and makes $4M?

  8. November 11, 2008 3:25 pm

    How do you know he makes $4M/year, and how do you know he has an even smaller group?

    The answer is partly because he sell $40 juice. The markup on the juice makes the so-called “J-factor” look like peanuts.

  9. Porkchopjim permalink
    November 12, 2008 8:29 am

    The ‘J-factor’ is what Amway gets for profit – not what IBOs overpay to get a rebate. Two different things.

    He said himself that he’ll make $4M – which limited his take of his $42M tool business to $2M.

    He has an even smaller group because not all of TEAM went with him, did they?

    You stayed with Amway, even after TEAM failed to build you a downline.

    What is the mark-up on the $40 juice? You sell (to yourself, anyway) $60 vitamins and $70 syrup. Should be plenty of profit (from yourself) potential there.

  10. November 12, 2008 12:13 pm

    The “J-factor” markup isn’t much different than most products you buy at most stores, about 1/3 manufacturing cost, 1/3 Amway profit, and 1/3 IBO profit. It’s different parts of the same thing.

    You believe a known lying coward? I would believe it if I saw his new tool prices and financial statement, but keep in mind his own CEO couldn’t testify to simple facts under oath.

    Plenty of time has passed to have a larger group than when he was with Amway.

    I never asked TEAM to build me a downline.

    The Double X is $51.65, and the syrup comes to about 50 cents per serving, far better price, let alone quality, than ANY other energy drink. My customers don’t seem to mind the prices.

  11. Porkchopjim permalink
    November 12, 2008 2:53 pm

    Products you buy from most stores has an Amway profit? That’ll be news to those uneducated WalMart shoppers!

    Anyway, it’s not different parts of the same thing. Manufacturer profit and retail mark-up aren’t the same. Amway overcharge to pay for rebates isn’t any part of those, either.

    How much is the mark-up on MV? You say it makes the J-factor look like peanuts – so what is it?

    Seeing as Amthrax likes to save you before you can Texplain your unsupported claims – we’ll hope you can give a straight answer for once.

    Don’t forget you were all excited about the new ‘stacking technique’ (that wasn’t new but you didn’t know any better) that was finally going to get you a downline. When Amway said “no” to Orrin, you had to change your tune on that quickly to stay true to your master and invent that you knew the difference between ‘appropriate’ and ‘inappropriate’ stacking when you didn’t even know it wasn’t new in the first place.

    Rehashing that you overpay for both vitamins and syrup doesn’t address why Orrin only made $500K selling similar priced junk with Amway vs. $4M with MV.

  12. Joecool permalink
    November 12, 2008 3:23 pm

    Tex reveals the flaw in his theory. The manufacturer makes a profit, Walmart adds on a margin and sells it to the consumer at the lowest possible cost. In tex’s described distribution method, 2/3 of the cost is someone’s margin.

    In the Walmart method, maybe 1/5 of the cost of a product is someone’s profit. The difference between 1/5 and 2/3 is 7/15.

    And 7/15 represents the difference in cost between Walmart and Amway. Looks about right where Walmart stuff costs about half of what Amway charges.

    For example, a case of water is $4.99 at Walmart and $47 from Amway. Walmart shampoo might cost $1.99 as compared to $8.00 from Amway. Amway has some comptetively priced products, but when you average it all out, Walmart wins hands down.

  13. November 12, 2008 4:57 pm

    Of course Walmart has Amway profit, that’s the nature of a cult!

    Manufacturer profit and retail markup are both part of the final customer cost.

    Amway doesn’t have a lot of the distribution or advertising costs, either. That’s why they can offer many products at competitive prices.

    I understand MV pays out at least 50% of their cost, which is probably not sustainable for a single/low number of products based company, when you factor in competitors. So there.

    Seeing as Amthrax can’t see you spout BS constantly, we’ll hope you can understand a straight answer for once.

    I’m still “excited” about the stacking technique, and knew it had been used years ago, but that doesn’t keep you from bringing up your lie again.

    I never claimed to know every aspect of proper and improper stacking, but I do know the major factors, and asked Amway for clarification, which they have NOT provided.

    I think Orrin made more on the order of $700K with Amway, but a combination of a higher markup, different pay plan, and a bigger group explains the difference. But as I said about, I doubt it’s sustainable.

    jc, when you cherry pick products to compare Walmart with Amway prices, and use non-comparable quality, you lose the argument hands down.

  14. Porkchopjim permalink
    November 13, 2008 8:08 am

    Manufacturer profit and retail markup are both part of the final customer cost.

    Thanks for saying something everyone here besides you seems to understand.

    And thanks for explaining why Amway products are overpriced because the ‘IBO profit’ isn’t a part of either the manufacturer or retail markup.

    You originally said that the MV mark-up made the J-factor look like peanuts.

    The J-factor is included in the manufacturing cost for Amway products. No one but Amway ever sees that money.

    MV mark-up is the money that is split between distributors.

    Two different things, not related, and in no way explains why Orrin makes more selling MV than he did Amway products.

    You want to try that again? Or are you holding out until Amthrax saves you again?

    Amway doesn’t have a lot of the distribution or advertising costs, either.

    Well, that’s because you PAY for shipping and distribution either explicitly or through combined overcharge with bulk orders.

    Advertising costs seem to have gone up, haven’t they?

    I understand MV pays out at least 50% of their cost, which is probably not sustainable for a single/low number of products based company, when you factor in competitors. So there.

    Amway pays out 34% – still doesn’t explain the vast difference between $500K and $4M. And just like Amway – there’s no ‘competition’ when you buy from yourself. All your extra Texgarbage about ‘sustainable’ is just as valuable as the rest of your business knowledge.

    So – that’s NOT a straight answer. Better hope Amthrax comes to your rescue soon!

    I’m still “excited” about the stacking technique, and knew it had been used years ago

    Yeah – that’s why you called it the ‘new stacking technique.’

    never claimed to know every aspect of proper and improper stacking, but I do know the major factors, and asked Amway for clarification, which they have NOT provided.

    You knew, but you didn’t know. Good TexAnswer! You learn that from John Kerry?

    a combination of a higher markup, different pay plan, and a bigger group explains the difference

    You ‘think’ the pay-out is 50%, and have no idea how big his group is.

    when you cherry pick products to compare Walmart with Amway prices, and use non-comparable quality, you lose the argument hands down.

    Which is exactly what your ‘price comparisons’ did that you crow about so much. You lose hands down.

  15. Joecool permalink
    November 13, 2008 9:59 am

    Walmart had 374 billion in sales. Quixtar had 1 billion in sales.

    Which company does the public think offeres the best value?

    Tex, you listening? The answer is “Walmart” You mention cherry picking products for comparison. I wonder if you could even cherry pick and find items that quixtar sell cheaper than Walmart? I bet that might take some effort.

  16. November 13, 2008 10:13 am

    Are you saying MV doesn’t have manufacturing costs, MV profit, and MV distributor profit as parts of their final cost?

    I think it does explain PART of the reason why Orrin is making more with MV than Amway. I also listed several other potential factors, which you ignored.

    There are other distribution costs besides shipping. These costs include shelf life, spoilage, damage, theft, multiple handling, etc.

    I’m happy with the additional advertising costs. More awareness can only lead to the end of the tool scam, or it is money being thrown away.

    The stacking technique was new to the vast majority of the IBO’s using it.

    It’s not “John Kerryish” to state I know the major factors, but not every single aspect.

    I believe I saw the payout was about 50% somewhere, don’t recall the source, and you certainly aren’t worth the effort to look it up. But use a little common sense, how much can a bottle of juice cost to make? Plus, you have no idea how big his group is, either. I was just listing factors that could lead to his greater profit, which should also include the one-time bonuses he probably “earned.”

    I was giving examples of competitively priced products to a statement there were NO competitively priced products. I win hands down.

    I think you’re using Walmart’s worldwide sales and Quixtar’s North American sales. Even considering the $7 billion/year, there are plenty of companies smaller than $7 billion/year. How much of a business opportunity do you have with Wally World? jc, you listening? the answer is “ZERO.”

    I already posted several products on qblog a couple of years ago.

  17. Joecool permalink
    November 13, 2008 11:46 am

    Tex, MV has manufacturing cost, MV profit, and MV distributor profit. Amway has manufacturing costs, Amway profit, and IBO profit.

    That’s why you can;t compare with Walmart. Walmart has manufacturing costs and they squeeze low prices out of the manufacturer by purchasing in bulk. They then sell it to the consumer. There is not IBO or distributor profit.

    That’s why Quixtar cannot compare prices with Walmart.

    I would venture to guess that just about anything you can get thru amway, you can get the exact same or similar product through Walmart cheaper. You can try to prove me wrong, but you’ll fail, just as you did in Amway. LOL

  18. Joecool permalink
    November 13, 2008 11:47 am

    LOL, what is Walmart’s North American sales? 356 billion? LOL

  19. Porkchopjim permalink
    November 13, 2008 12:41 pm

    Are you saying MV doesn’t have manufacturing costs, MV profit, and MV distributor profit as parts of their final cost?

    Apparently you can’t read. Try again.

    I think it does explain PART of the reason why Orrin is making more with MV than Amway. I also listed several other potential factors, which you ignored.

    So what if I ignored them? They were guesses. You made bold statements about the MV payback vs. the ‘J-factor’ and have been trying to backpeddle since.

    There are other distribution costs besides shipping.

    You said there weren’t a lot of them anyway – so why bring up more all of a sudden? You get lost again? And suddenly, you’ve gone from ‘little advertising costs’ to ‘happy with the increase.’ This is what 15 years of tapes and parroting useless phrases gets you: contradiction after contradiction.

    The stacking technique was new to the vast majority of the IBO’s using it.

    Including you – because if you did the ‘due dilligence’ you claim you did and actually found out about ‘stacking’ before you called it ‘new’ – you would have ‘discovered’ the tool scam a lot sooner than 12 years into Amway.

    I believe I saw the payout was about 50% somewhere, don’t recall the source, and you certainly aren’t worth the effort to look it up.

    I knew you couldn’t provide any supporting evidence for your outlandish claims – just glad to see you admit it before Amthrax saved you.

    I was giving examples of competitively priced products to a statement there were NO competitively priced products. I win hands down.

    Nope – again that’s a lie right here for everyone to see. Here’s what JC said “Amway has some comptetively priced products, but when you average it all out, Walmart wins hands down.”

    You have to change what people say to try to make yourself look right? You’ve done it twice just in this post.

    Despite your claims otherwise, Amway cannot compete with WalMart for price and quality. JC is right.

  20. November 13, 2008 2:05 pm

    jc, Walmart doesn’t have many manufacturing costs, they don’t make many things. They pay the manufacturers a manufacturing cost plus a profit for the manufacturers. They have other costs that are much larger than Amway’s model, such as more employees, stores (land, building construction/maintenance, utilities), insurance, advertising, etc. Amway takes the money they would have otherwise used to pay for all of these things and pays it to the IBO’s. You were an IBO, right? I already found products that compare well with Walmart, as I said earlier.

    pcj, don’t average it all out. Buy what you want at Walmart, and buy what you want with Amway. There is no such thing as an “average.” Different people will value different products sets for different reasons. So what?

    Despite your claims otherwise, Amway can compete with Walmart for price and quality, but not on ALL products. Tex is right (as usual).

  21. Porkchopjim permalink
    November 13, 2008 3:20 pm

    pcj, don’t average it all out.

    I didn’t. I quoted JC because you claimed he said ‘NO competitively priced products’ which was flat out wrong on your part…and now you’re trying to change it again?

    Three times in two posts you have to change what people say to pretend you are correct?

    Despite your claims otherwise, Amway can compete with Walmart for price and quality, but not on ALL products. Tex is right (as usual).

    Walmart’s growth in sales and profit – which each quarter is roughly what stagnant Amway can barely do in sales – adds lots of validity to your claim.

  22. Joecool permalink
    November 13, 2008 4:18 pm

    http://www.amquix.info/sa8-2007_consumer_reports.html

    Great comparison. Walmart wins again!

  23. November 13, 2008 4:20 pm

    The point I was addressing was the assumption you MUST buy ALL products through Amway. I realize this is taught by many groups, including mine, but it is not smart business. You get tangled up in the details and miss the main point. I don’t go through every word and analyze the post or my response from every possible angle, I’m not interested in taking that kind of time on “people” like you. Just ask a question, I’ll clarify, but I think you know the answer, you are more interested in arguing than anything else.

    Who cares how big Walmart is? There are plenty of companies smaller than Amway. Get rid of the tool scam, and the growth will be much better, which, unlike Walmart growth, financially benefits IBO’s.

  24. Joecool permalink
    November 13, 2008 4:57 pm

    Price comparison done on my blog. Quixtar vs. Costco.

    This may be a surprise, but Costco wins this one.

    http://joecool-quixtar-thedreamorthescheme.blogspot.com/2007/11/quixtar-prices-versus-costco.html

  25. Porkchopjim permalink
    November 13, 2008 7:23 pm

    The point I was addressing was the assumption you MUST buy ALL products through Amway.

    4th change in this thread already. Pathetic.

    I’m not interested in taking that kind of time on “people” like you.

    Doesn’t matter, you end up looking foolish regardless. It’s when you actually pay attention that your real craziness comes out.

    Just ask a question, I’ll clarify

    Proven wrong everytime.

    you are more interested in arguing than anything else.

    Wrong. I am most interested in the Tex Transparency Initiative so that you get the full appreciation that you deserve from anyone who might remotely consider listening to anything you say.

    WalMart growth certainly DOES benefit IBOs. First, it gives them a place where they can spend whatever little money remains after buying overpriced products from themselves, plus it exposes them to real prices and may actually hasten their quitting – which is the best thing any IBO can do.

  26. November 13, 2008 7:47 pm

    4th time being an idiot in a single post already. Pathetic.

    You end up looking foolish regardless. It’s when you actually pay attention that your real craziness comes out. Now I know why you’re scared of that telephone call.

    Proven wrong every time.

    Yawn….

  27. Joecool permalink
    November 14, 2008 10:06 am

    The yawn means tex has been schooled once again.

  28. November 14, 2008 10:15 am

    Exactly. Whenever I read a “yawn” from Tex, it signals to me that he’s giving up on the conversation. Took him awhile on this thread.

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