Skip to content

TEAM LIFE in 31 Days

June 28, 2011

Orrin Woodward likes acronyms. His first group was called the Team of Destiny (TOD) before changing it to TEAM, or Together Everyone Achieves More. In a few weeks, he’ll be at it again with the launch of Living Intentionally For Excellence (LIFE).

LIFE is focused on the eight F’s:

  • Family
  • Faith
  • Fun
  • Fitness
  • Finance
  • Freedom
  • Following
  • Friends

There’s been speculation as to the exact nature of LIFE. Is it a re-branding of TEAM or will LIFE be a separate MLM business (akin to MonaVie) that TEAM members can profit from? I think it’s a little of both.

Check out the LIFE website which is counting down the days to the big launch on July 29, 2011. The date happens to coincide with the start of the second Leadership Convention being held in Columbus, Ohio, on the same day.


It’s been clear to anyone who’s been reading Orrin Woodward’s tweets that he’s been hanging out with people in the self-help and life coaching community. No doubt, Orrin has been picking their brains on how to structure this LIFE business from a logistical and legal perspective. Right now, the majority of sales of TEAM tools have been to TEAM members. I have the feeling that they are going to try to market LIFE materials to the general public1. If this is the case, the rumors that LIFE is actually a new MLM venture have extra weight.

Whither MonaVie? Will the F in Fitness mean they’ll continue to hawk and purchase the purple jungle juice? Will they find something else to sell (hopefully not something like Perfect Water)? What does Dallin Larsen think of LIFE?

I don’t think that the TEAM moniker is going the way of the TOD or Quixtar. If you look at TEAM’s web site, you’ll see that Orrin has taken a page out from the “fashion gurus” at R3Global. Subtlety is not one of the hallmarks of Brig Hart, and it shows in loud apparel he wears on stage and in his videos. Take a look for yourself. Do you want to be caught out in public wearing a shirt that says, “I’M A LIFER” on one side and TEAM on the other.

If you’re a TEAM member, you’re going to be heavily encouraged to buy new clothes for your new business. In fact, you’re going to be encouraged to purchase “brand-new” versions of your favorite CDs, books, flip charts, and business cards! It doesn’t matter if they’re just re-branded versions of the exact same things you have in your closet today. You’re not a true LIFER if you’re still rocking the old TEAM tools and clothes!

Now, I know that Orrin doesn’t like to talk anymore about his past in Amway and Quixtar, but wasn’t he one of those distributors who were bummed out about the name change from Quixtar back to Amway? Despite his lofty distributor status, he didn’t really have much say in the matter, from what I understand. I wonder now, if there are some TEAM members who aren’t on-board with the shift in focus from MonaVie to LIFE or a possible name change from TEAM to LIFE. Tough luck for them… for the word of Woodward is law.

Some of these questions will no doubt be answered at the Leadership Conventions next month. Ex-TEAM and current TEAM members, what are your thoughts on the upcoming LIFE venture of Orrin Woodward and TEAM?


1 Remember, Orrin tried this once before after his termination from Amway/Quixtar.

102 Comments leave one →
  1. Rob Thomas permalink
    June 28, 2011 6:42 am

    Interesting to say the least. Quite honestly, the only reason I stuck around TEAM for 3 years was the leadership/life training (selling/pushing bubba juice wasn’t my thing). I was “plugged in” to a system that really did help me in a lot of aspects of my life, so I see some potential merit in LIFE. Now, could that same material be gotten for a much cheaper cost? Absolutely! Again, if the product (in this case LIFE material) can be gotten for a price that is competitive with other leadership/life enhancing materials, then it could be successful. Otherwise, its another way to line the pockets of the few that are able to bring the most people to the party.

  2. Burned Out With MV permalink
    June 28, 2011 9:04 am

    8 F”s? …….. lets add a 9th one …. FUBAR 🙂

  3. Speak Your Truth permalink
    June 28, 2011 9:55 am

    BOW/MV That is hilarious.

  4. Speak Your Truth permalink
    June 28, 2011 9:04 pm

    Amthrax~ You pointed out some good points and made me laugh on the lifer clothing thing, that just makes me think of those people in prison, lol.

    I fail to see where anything they do is any different then they have always done for the past 2 decades with A/ Quixtar/Amway, then 6 months standing alone, then to Monavie and now their Lifer program.

    To me it is been a bunch of hype, and unless they are dropping MV all together, there is no difference at all because they will still expect others to spend the money on the juice and go broke by compounding their exspenses with their ‘system’. How would this be different for anyone? There might be some difference in their profit-sharing or the ‘legal loop-hole’ as we have heard but have no contract for that. But as we have been told they have control over that and THEY control whether they think you are ‘worthy’ of that pay, regardless of how much time, effort, and money you invested to bring them the $$ and the ‘customers’. They will take your team and money if they chose.

    Another mixed message, they bash other companies, bosses etc, and tell you they are NOT like any ‘traditional’ business then turn right around and say ‘just like any other business.’ Deception, double speak and mixed messages continuely to suit their agenda. Just because you Claim you are a ‘life’ coaching business doesn’t change anything about the way they do things. And if they are dropping MV, then what does Dallin say about the deal and where does this leave their credibility and ‘loyalty’ with him?

    After so many times of this (most) people just get sick of the ‘this is the best-business bar-none’ and start to question the authenticity and it then becomes clear to most, it is all about the MONEY and they throw in the making a difference to coerce others emotionally.

    They have always promoted ‘the system’ more than the ‘product’ it is just a front; their way to parasitically attach themselves, to make it seem legit and to ‘sell their original Amway system.’

    This is another double standard, they demand loyality, “you are with us or against us” but show absolutely no loyality to the companies they hawk their ‘system’ to. How is there HONESTY & INTEGRITY in what they say? It is just becomes wha, wha, wha, wha, wha.
    It is obvious to all of us who experienced their completely controlling enviroment that what matters the most is; multimillions- MONEY for the PC and the loss for the rest, and their ‘guru’ status/image they try so hard to convince others of their purity, holier than thou character.

    They have a lot of damages and restitution to pay to thousands upon thousands, that they completely want to ignore, put in their past, ‘just forget about it’, sweep it under the rug, and expect no consequences or responsiblity for the damages they themselves, have done.

    So, the way I see it, is they won’t EVER prosper, they will continue to fail and lose people more than ever, until they reconcile all those damages because the laws of nature will catch up and bite them like a poisonous snake, the consequeces will eventually, be forced.
    They aren’t willing to humble themselves on their own so someone or something else will.

    Their is a price to be paid, for arrogance, cheating, lies, deceiving, stealing, ignoring the truth, and not making amends or restution; how that shows up we will see.

    Their unwillings to own up and reconcile the damages, and take responsiblity from within, most definitely will show up from without!

  5. I'm a Lifer permalink
    June 30, 2011 8:00 am

    I would much rather be on TEAM where I have a Positive attitude then sit around writing a blog stating how much my life sucks. Everything I read on here is Wah Wah Wah from all these posters. Sorry..but my LIFE is better with TEAM and maybe a change in attitude can help all you negative people realize that attitude is everything. If I can help even one person, I am completely satisfied with my effots.

  6. webelieved permalink
    June 30, 2011 8:12 am

    Speak- They have always promoted ‘the system’ more than the ‘product’ it is just a front; their way to parasitically attach themselves, to make it seem legit and to ‘sell their original Amway system.’
    Ditto! We know this to be true!

  7. webelieved permalink
    June 30, 2011 8:15 am

    “We build community and any product will attatch itself to us, when we have a large community”
    Funny then Orrin says Team isn’t the residual business that was promoted to us !
    Seems to me HE IS LYING!

  8. webelieved permalink
    June 30, 2011 8:24 am

    Seems pretty contradictary to me, Orrin says that Team wasn’t the business, to people he stole from and then makes his training company Team an seperate mlm and keeps ours and others groups? Wonder what a judge would say about that? My guess is they would say he owes a lot of people a lot of money for stealing their groups, giving them and their pay to others and falsly advertising a residual income for years? Hmmmm I wonder……
    Talk about speaking in circles!
    What do you think was Team promoted as the business or was Quixtar/Amway/ MV?
    My vote= TEAM.

  9. June 30, 2011 8:37 am

    Many of the posters are saying that their life sucked while in TEAM, adding that their lives are much better today. Being on TEAM (or LIFE) is not a requirement for having a positive attitude.

    Here’s the bottom line – you might be spending $500/month to be a part of TEAM. You might say it’s worth it now, great. How about 6 years from now and $36,000 later? What would you think if the TEAM leadership took your business out from under you? Would you be happy about this, all because TEAM made you think that everything happens for a (positive) reason?

  10. I'm a Lifer permalink
    June 30, 2011 9:03 am

    Good point Amthrax. However, I have to say, I spend $50,000 on a 4 year college education that didn’t provide me a single thing. I’ve received more “value” in my time in the TEAM Leadership system then my 4 years of college. To me, the cost are worth the price and if I make a little money of the product (which I feel is a really good product) then all the more reason to keep me happy. People don’t have to spend a lot of money on the materials, products, etc. The Magic word is “NO”. I’ve said “NO” on many occassions because if I don’t have the money, I’m not buying the material. I hear horror stories of people going into debt in this business and I can’t believe it. I’ve actually moved a little closer to being out of debt. As with anything, People need to be “Responsible” with their decisions. Responsibility is the key to making any business venture work. If a person doesn’t make fiscally responsible choices, then of course their business won’t succeed. I think this business has helped me to believe in myself more and helps me to realize that I have choices in my life. No one in my upline has bullied me into anything and everyone has been very supportive. Obviously I must have a better upline then most I guess. I think when it comes right down to it, we all have a choice to make based on what we feel is important to our Life.

  11. Burned Out With MV permalink
    June 30, 2011 9:20 am

    Can’t help but wonder how long lifer has been a lifer and how much if any real profit has been made in the biz so far, both MV and TEAM.

    I’m interested in real facts and real numbers not a bunch of canned hype, I’m glad you found a place you feel good about being, I did too for a while, then realism set in.

  12. webelieved permalink
    June 30, 2011 9:22 am

    Lifer- We didn’t have a choice when we followed and BUILT A HUGE BUSINESS and HAD IT STOLEN AND DESTROYED by the same people you watch on stage and parrot!
    We didn’t get in Team to just have our egos stroked, be part of a group and feel good, we got in to build a business, a residual income, like we were recruited to do! Get a clue!
    Go read all the posts on EX-Team Comments, that may give you a clue why we are “Negative” about Team! As far as the rest of my life, I am very happy and living intentionally for excellence, just like I always did. Who are you to judge if I am a Negative person in my life? You do not know me! I do not think my life sucks, only a portion of it did. The part when I realized I was following liars and cheaters, greedy people who claim to be Christians and are misleading people! Unfortunatly, there ARE NEGATIVE things that happened in life and on Team. I am living intentionally here too. Doing my God directed duty to tell the truth of my experiences with Team and Orrin Woodward! God does not call me to protect the few at the top, from the truth of what they are doing and have done.
    I would respectfully ask you to go watch THE WAVE and read Merchants of Deception (listed on the right). It may help you. 🙂

  13. webelieved permalink
    June 30, 2011 9:24 am

    Notice how once again a LIFER didn’t answer Amthrax’s questions! So typical!

  14. webelieved permalink
    June 30, 2011 9:32 am

    Do these people think we did not think and feel the same way? Get a clue! We were in longer, up front with PC, we know more than you . Shouldn’t you take advice with someone with results and experience? If you do not heed our warning, that’s your choice, I guess you cannot say you weren’t warned. I know, I didn’t listen to anyone either! Although I didn’t have leaders telling truths about Team when I was in. Do you not get there are triple 100’s, Round Table members, it seems office members or at lest people at the Conference table of Team, speaking on this site?
    Amthrax- It is so clear to me the brainwashing. They all come here with the Don’t be negative crap, they cannot logically critically think. What would be my motive for telling these things? MONEY? NOPE, but that is a motive for Orrin and your upline!
    I give up…..lifer, if you want to, go back and swim with the sharks!

  15. Speak Your Truth permalink
    June 30, 2011 10:00 am

    Im a lifer~ LOL
    oh how fitting the ‘lifer’ is. I can see you have stopped thinkng on your own by your comments, you are losing your own identity. Did you believe your college was worthless, the 4 years you were attending?They have changed your belief and that is exactly their intention. The good news is when you are in deep debt about a year from now, you will quit and then regain your own thinking back sooner or later because undue influence and mind control are only temporary, but can be very damaging emotionally and spiritually to your life.

    Now, you have bought into the lie that your time on team is worth more than your college education because you have heard everyone on the Team say the same thing. How is that you didn’t believe that before and now you do? You are chosing to ignore the truth of what is said on here and just calling it ‘negative’ because you can’t face reality. LIFE and some experiences are negative, if you don’t accept that, then you are being real. If you would open your eyes you would see that being stolen from, cheated lied to and deceiving others like you are chosing to do every time you show someone the business is wrong.
    Why do you think they don’t disclose all the information to prospects and all people on the team? There is plenty you don’t know.

    You are just like the other ‘lifers’, how clever they are with the ‘lifer’ the more they say it and get everyone else to say it, the more the subconscious will buy into it and the more people will feel guilty when they leave. They know this and I’m sure it is with a very specific intent, does matter if someone tells a lie, the longer someone hears it they know you will eventually believe it. I am sure you aren’t making any money and bet you don’t get much attention from your upline because you are not ‘all in’, you say no to anything because you say you don’t have the money, you won’t be around long. Good luck hope you’re not too embarassed or hurt by calling yourself a ‘lifer’ when you have to face that after you quit.

  16. Speak Your Truth permalink
    June 30, 2011 10:03 am

    LIFE and some experiences are negative, if you don’t accept that, then you are being real.
    was suppose to say you aren’t being real or true to yourself.

  17. I'm a Lifer permalink
    June 30, 2011 10:43 am

    WOW!!! I didn’t say anything negative about all of you guys on here you just put me down only because I said I am happy about my decision. Webelieved-Did I once judge anyone by the two commments I made. I was simply sharing why I believe it is right for me. Not once did I judge your comments. Heck, I even told Amthrax that his comments were nice. Here I was looking for a healthy debate on the subject, but instead I’m subjected to all these put-downs. I’m sorry all of you have had your bad experiences…but every business in America is going to have ones that work for them and ones that don’t. And NO, I have Not stopped thinking on my own “Speak”…I am in clear mind and have made my own choices of what to listen to and what to purchase. Anyway, if you want to trash talk…then I’m checking out on this discussion.

  18. I'm a Lifer permalink
    June 30, 2011 10:47 am

    PS…I’ve made some very good friends who are still friends even after I showed them “the plan” that you speak of. It isn’t the business…it is the person’s attitude. I’m not going to trash people just because they decide to not get into my business….

  19. Speak Your Truth permalink
    June 30, 2011 10:48 am

    CLEVERLY TRAPPED WITH THE ‘LIFER’! Definitely an indoctinating phrase.
    Bet they were wishing they came up with that one years ago, more guilt for the person to feel if the ”Quit” which MOST do because it is unstainable, they will have told themselves and will have heard that a million times before the pressure of debt overcomes them or they found out what we did that it is flat out corrupt with some very controlling leaders and as for me they are very sick.
    They are even using it as their identity, EEks!

  20. Speak Your Truth permalink
    June 30, 2011 10:51 am

    You called others negative didn’t you?

  21. switch permalink
    June 30, 2011 11:01 am

    Have you purchased your t-shirt yet, Lifer?…..how can you say “NO” to that one?

    LIER says-
    “I would much rather be on TEAM where I have a Positive attitude then sit around writing a blog stating how much my life sucks”

    Where did I ever say my life sucked? LOL. That’s only in the land of “team deception”.

    LIER says-
    “Everything I read on here is Wah Wah Wah from all these posters. Sorry..but my LIFE is better with TEAM and maybe a change in attitude can help all you negative people realize that attitude is everything. If I can help even one person, I am completely satisfied with my effots.”

    Denial much?…..”Attitude is everything”, I see the system is working well for you!

    LIER says-
    “However, I have to say, I spend $50,000 on a 4 year college education that didn’t provide me a single thing.”

    I’d love to see the letter you sent to your professional, well trained professors who gave you their time and education that you didn’t get one thing out of their education. You’re so proud of being a part of team correct?….. Go back and show them your plan if it’s so much better than what they have to offer. I’m sure they could be on your “list of people” right? Why not, right?!

    LIER says-
    “As with anything, People need to be “Responsible” with their decisions.”

    If you’re saying “People need to be “Responsible” with their decisions”, then the lifers can start with being responsible for THEIR decisions in spreading illegal claims and testimonies to ALL the innocent, hard working individuals around them. Second, you can touch base on the history behind it all because if this is such a WONDERFUL opportunity, I’m sure you have plenty of info to share.

    LIER says-
    “Responsibility is key to making it work”……

    Put your money where your mouth is, and show us the true meaning behind “RESPONSIBILITY”.

  22. I'm a Lifer permalink
    June 30, 2011 11:02 am

    If your not negative, then I didn’t call you negative. If you are a negative person, then I meant it for you. Only you know the answer to that…..

  23. switch permalink
    June 30, 2011 11:24 am

    If I’m the new LIFER prospect, I have all sorts of questions on your “success story” on how you got there.

    Please answer the questions.

  24. I'm a Lifer permalink
    June 30, 2011 11:33 am

    No I didn’t buy a t-shirt..Yet…Let me say this loud and clear..YOU DON’T NEED TO BUY EVERYTHING!!!!!!!!!! You have the choice to say NO.

    Life DOES Suck…It sucked before TEAM and it still Sucks after being on TEAM. LIFE Isn’t suppose to be EASY. LIFE is hard…but I found it much easier to have a POSITIVE Attitude.

    AND Yes, I will be showing my Professors “THE PLAN”….

    I’m not holding a gun to people’s head and telling them they have to get in. FREEDDOM of Choice is Number ONE in my book.

    I’m sure that didn’t answer all your questions…but you get my POINT.

  25. Speak Your Truth permalink
    June 30, 2011 11:51 am

    Lifer~ Oh contraire, this is what you said;” Sorry..but my LIFE is better with TEAM and maybe a change in attitude can help ALL (emphasis mine) you negative people realize that attitude is everything. “
    Nice try though.

    Do you just assume everyone is ‘negative’ that is not on team? Would you rather have someone lie to you than tell the truth?

    Many questions you didn’t answer, is there a reason for that? Personally, I wouldn’t care if you spent the rest of your life/’lifer’ donating all your money but you are being deceived therefore, you deceive others, it is the others I am concerned with.

    Did you know all the leaders that left and why? Pastor Dickie, and all of his family that were working for the Team, Quad, Triples, Turbo’s and thousands of others not to mention Haugens, Florence,Goetchel, Smiths, and ALL the rest? Do you blindly believe what they are telling you about them leaving, or do you just ‘chose’ to ignore and keep your head in the sand and not use your common sense because it doesn’t seem to ‘positive’?

  26. switch permalink
    June 30, 2011 11:52 am

    So, tell me about your journey to “success” with team.

  27. Speak Your Truth permalink
    June 30, 2011 11:53 am

    Good luck on your journey, hope you can fake it til you make it.

  28. I'm a Lifer permalink
    June 30, 2011 12:10 pm

    GO TEAM…FIRED UP!!!!

    I was a run down beat up alcoholic and TEAM helped me to see the light….

    OMG, It was a normal journey…just looking for a business to build and I like the people I work with…GEEZ you guys are too much.

  29. Speak Your Truth permalink
    June 30, 2011 12:32 pm

    Your arrogance is so loud, you will be humbled.

  30. I'm a Lifer permalink
    June 30, 2011 12:37 pm

    Hmmmmm didn’t seem to me after reading this article that Randy Haugen left on bad terms with Orrin and Chris….hmmmmmmmmm

    http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Amway/Randy_Haugen_Speaks.html

  31. June 30, 2011 12:41 pm

    @I’m a Lifer:

    Question for you. What is the business that you’re promoting to your prospects? MonaVie? TEAM? LIFE? Aside from the personal development, how do you make money on MonaVie? On TEAM? On LIFE? Since you seem more plugged in than we are, I’m curious what is being taught right now.

  32. I'm a Lifer permalink
    June 30, 2011 12:42 pm

    Seems like just all bad blood with the Amway crap if you ask me….

  33. I'm a Lifer permalink
    June 30, 2011 12:47 pm

    My wife and I love the TEAM system and this is what our biggest promotion is for us. Everyone has something a little different. We love the Monavie products…especially the EMV energy drinks. Fact is, if you like a product, use it. 🙂 We make money from Monavie from preferred customer sources and also from commission in our growing business in the two leg structure. Fact is – This business isn’t for anyone, but it works for us. And as I said, a person doesn’t have to go into debt if they don’t want to. I budget our time and resources wisely as I would with any business opportunity.

  34. June 30, 2011 1:13 pm

    @I’m a Lifer:

    Thanks for your response. Now, if you would like to directly debate the content of my posts, I welcome your comments. One thing that is frustrating when speaking with current TEAM members on this blog is that their comments are typically devoid of real content. Many comments are in the form of, “You’re negative and a loser! I’m positive and moving on with my life.” They rarely address the topic discussed in the actual post, which is what I would like the conversation steered towards.

  35. I'm a Lifer permalink
    June 30, 2011 1:19 pm

    I’m open for debate…but at the same time, I don’t want to be torn apart by others on this site for the choices I have made in my life. I don’t feel any of you are losers. I believe with any business opportunity, some work out and some don’t. I really have enjoyed the whole network marketing experience. I’ve met some people who have impacted my life, not just on the business side, but in other areas as well. We are people..and we are suppose to relate with other people…..Besides…I realy enjoying debating issues. 🙂

  36. switch permalink
    June 30, 2011 1:23 pm

    Lifer says-
    “Everyone has something a little different.”

    Oh, no doubt they do! From no more sleep deprivation, no more joint pain, and curing cancer….the juice is your answer, correct?

    Tell me about Royal Tongan Limu and what happened there?

  37. I'm a Lifer permalink
    June 30, 2011 1:42 pm

    I buy it because it taste good. LOL. And my son has lost weight thanks to Reveal. 🙂 ….oh, and the EMV is very tasty especially over ice. Never heard of Royal Tongan Limu and I don’t really care. (Well I did look it up just now). Doesn’t matter. How many companies have been forced to shut their doors in the mlm business? I bet more then this one.

  38. switch permalink
    June 30, 2011 2:20 pm

    You shell out at least $140 for one case a month all because of it “tasting good”?

    Tell me why I should buy your juice over V8 fusion or the option V8 offers for a tenth of the cost?

  39. I'm a Lifer permalink
    June 30, 2011 2:34 pm

    Actually I shell out $120 for a Case and it comes out to $3.00 a day. If I was a smoker, I would be paying more for the cigarettes. I buy the EMV more then I’m buying the other juice products right now. The EMV is better for you then other energy drinks on the market and the price is equivelant. If you like V8 better, then buy it….

  40. Speak Your Truth permalink
    June 30, 2011 4:21 pm

    LOL lifer~ Funny you use that article that was before he left. Now what is your lame excuse for the ALL the REST? It doesn’t matter either, because your OK with bringing people into a corrupt system where they steal people’s profit-sharing, teams, use deceptive recruiting techniques lie and cheat others and on and on. It is obvious the choice you made, sure says a lot about your character.

  41. No Team For Me permalink
    June 30, 2011 8:21 pm

    Lifer – I won’t say how much more, but it’s safe to say that while I was in Amway/Quixtar without Team, I personally earned over $1/2 million of gross income. I also had a group filled with people making a net profit month after month.

    After becoming a part of Team with MonaVie, aside from myself, I did not have a single leader in my group make any net profit after Team expenses. Every single one of them had a net loss. Every sinlge leader. Every one of them!

    After leaving Team and getting rid of the Team’s ridiculous expenses, they are back to making a net profit again.

    Orrin always says “specific measurable results or something must change”. I dare you to add up how much money your team is spending on system –
    $10 a couple every Tuesday night * 52 weeks = $520
    $60 a couple every month for the monthly * 12 = $720
    $240 a couple for the major * 3 = $720
    Top 50, Tool Trunk, 1st night pack, Addtnl Info Pack, Culture Pack, Depth Pack, Leadership Pack, LLR2 Pack, Relationship Pack, Follow-up Pack, Power Player Pack,
    Showing The Plan Pack, and dozens of other packs (most of which change every year so a “leader” will want to set an example by having the updated pack) = at least $2,500
    Monthly System – 16 CD’s & 2 books a month plus shipping * 12 = $1,000
    Extra 1st Night packs, addtnl info packs, culture packs & individual CD’s to hand out to prospects & downline = minimum of $1-2,000 a year for anyone who considers themselves a leader

    I dare you to add up all those costs and multiply them times everyone you see in the room at your local seminar next month and ask yourself this question. Let’s take a “hypothetical”. (which may not be so hypothetical 🙂 suppose a local has several hundred people coming to the local. Lot’s multiply $6,000 times 200 people = $1,200,000 (That’s 1.2 MILLION dollars!!!!) not counting the 200 people who were churned throughtou the year that got in, spent hundreds or thousands of dollars but didn’t stay in. And not counting the people on system who don’t go to all the seminars. Let’s be conservative and say that’s an extra $300,000. So we’re at $1.5 million spent in one local area.

    Now, power players are supposed to be showing the plan 15 times per month (15 hours per month), following up with those people (15 hours per month),plus time at Opens (2 hours per week), seminars (8 hours once a month), majors (24 hours * 3 per year), reading 15 min per night in a Team book, phone calling for those meetings (15-30 hours per month), getting new people started (15 hours per month) = conservatively 800 hours per year for a power player. We’ll also say 1/8 of those people are power players ( we won’t count double & triple power players) at least 1/3 of those people do half that amount and 1/3 of those people do 1/5 that amount, and the rest do nothing. That’s 56,000 hours.

    Now, how many new Emerald’s broke last year in that city?……..(cricket, cricket) Ruby’s?…..Golds???!!!!!

    Okay, so if a corporate vice-president of a division spent $1.5 million and over 56.000 hours of labor and couldn’t produce a single person who was consistently earning $50,000 a year?????? Remember the famous “specific measurable results or something must change”? Time to ditch the overpriced, non-effective system and work on truly helping people.

  42. Dorothy permalink
    June 30, 2011 7:59 pm

    This commenter requested that her comments be removed from this site.

  43. Dorothy permalink
    June 30, 2011 8:06 pm

    This commenter requested that her comments be removed from this site.

  44. Speak Your Truth permalink
    June 30, 2011 10:45 pm

    No Team For Me~
    No ‘real leader’ can argue those figures are very close and accurate.Excellent post! Thanks for sharing that. Even those years we made a profit, it was pittance, would definitely qualify for ‘povery level’ because we were ‘real leaders’ who continuely dumped thousands of hours and tens of thousands into stock for our team and ourselves doing and going to every flippin meeting and ‘special meetings’ etc.etc.. most of our profits went back into the funnel that went directly into the PC pockets. The MILES and gas was unreal and also we ran seminars and opens that cost out of OUR POCKET if they didn’t make a profit; but oh if they MADE a profit then it went directly to the TEAM. The Greed; is indescibable.They suck people dry. So there are many, many more hidden expsenses that MOST will never know about. Someone will come on here at say that has changed, well good for them, where’s the restitution then for those they did rip off?

    It never ceases to amaze me how blindly everyone follows. If they only knew some of the books that Orrin and am sure other PC have read that specifically teach how to MANIPULATE AND DESTROY, it would blow their mind. Their ‘I care’, It’s all a facade; they are ruthless. They only ‘care’ and use people as pawns and are only useful for performance and giving up their bank accounts.

    Most grateful we are gone.

  45. Dorothy permalink
    June 30, 2011 10:02 pm

    This commenter requested that her comments be removed from this site.

  46. Burned Out With MV permalink
    July 1, 2011 4:14 am

    Still wonderering about the profit question …………. :-/

  47. I Quit ( and glad I Did) permalink
    July 1, 2011 5:00 am

    Hey lifer- You obviously aren’t making much money with the biz. How do I know? It’s simple… once you have a sizeable team it is imperative to have edification from the big gurus. If you are picking and choosing from the system you can’t, and won’t get big because the “leaders” will withhold edification. I SPEAK FROM EXPERIENCE. Good luck.
    Now twist it up any which way you want- I’m enjoying the laughs.

  48. Steve permalink
    July 1, 2011 6:44 am

    Dorothy;

    Like most of you who post here, something is said, and it reminds me of some shenanigans that went on in our group. Today as I read your post, and you explained how people got sponsored, and how personals were derived at, brought back memories of another corrupt way that Team building was established by our upline. We were told to do exactly what we were doing while with Quixtar. We would make the brand new sign-up a personal for the last person on the tree. That way they would already have a personal, even though they knew nothing about them, who they were, where they lived, worse yet, were they even interested in building a business? All under the guise of showing “how fast this builds, and you already have a business partner to work with.” A business partner to work with? Are you kidding me? Lets just say he or she lives in the same city, and you the new guy, call your brand new personal (business partner) on the phone to let him or her know that you Mr. New Guy is their sponsor. You want to get toghether and meet your new business partner. He or she immediatley asks who are you, and tells you I signed up with so and so, not you. Can you imagine the awkwardness with the new guy, and the brand new sign-up. Before you can say “wait Mr. New Guy let the system teach you how to do this, they are both gone. Now if your new personal lives in another part of the state, another state, or another country chances are that phone call is never made, and again that new grouping quits because the actual person who sponored them is told to work with only their personals. How do I know this? I will repeat, because it happened in our group. This practice of sponoring people and assigning them to the the last IBO on the tree, without them knowing who they are, was part of the reason they got into so much trouble with Quixtar. I wonder if MV knew or knows anything about this building practice. Wow it is amazing how the truth can be said here and it will trigger a distant unethical memory. Sheesh what a shame. What the heck were we thinking?

  49. switch permalink
    July 1, 2011 7:10 am

    Lifer-
    My point being is that there’s no way in hell you jump from livingroom to livingroom selling the juice for that price all because it “tastes good”. And don’t try and silence me by telling me it doesn’t matter. You’re simply not seeing what we’re trying to spell out for you and that would in fact make you responsible for your decisions but not ONE team member can face the facts. IT IS SICK!

    There’s other strategic plans that M.V. has been called on and warned about including using illegal health claims, and using celebs to falsely promote their products like Oprah, and Dr. Oz who have filed suit against all these acai companies including Mona Vie. It’s ILLEGAL to do that and for the record, it’s still happening.

    For Larsen to not claim responsibility is nothing short of criminal.

  50. Steve permalink
    July 1, 2011 7:14 am

    I guess I answered my own question. We weren’t thinking.

  51. I'm a Lifer permalink
    July 1, 2011 7:48 am

    God is Good…Have a Great LIFE!

  52. humiliated permalink
    July 1, 2011 7:48 am

    LIFER, you have got to be kidding me. You act all offended, saying you didn’t say anything negative about the people that have posted on here. Are you FREAKING kidding me? Let’s take a look at your initial post, shall we?

    “I would much rather be on TEAM where I have a Positive attitude then sit around writing a blog stating how much my life sucks. Everything I read on here is Wah Wah Wah from all these posters. Sorry..but my LIFE is better with TEAM and maybe a change in attitude can help all you negative people realize that attitude is everything. If I can help even one person, I am completely satisfied with my effots.”

    How are you not calling EVERYONE on here negative, requiring an attitude change? Read your post again…slowly. Just for future reference, that is not how you open up a “healthy” debate, by personally attacking everyone on the panel.

    This is exactly the kind of double speak, manipulation that I consistently see with you TEAMERS. You come on here and insult EVERYONE, then act shocked when they defend themselves against your nasty words.

    The people that are blogging on here felt exactly the same way as you did at one time. They had the GREATEST upline, full of the most honest & well intentioned people. Perhaps some of them were, and some weren’t, but the bottom line is there were some very shady things going on with Orrin and the rest of his gang. You are essentially saying that it is ok to hang around with a bunch of criminals because some of them don’t know they are criminals and the others are really nice criminals.

    THere has not been one person that has said that there lives suck after leaving TEAM. They HAVE said that their lives were destroyed while in TEAM and now they are re-building them. They have said they are much happier now that they are out. THey are also still grieving the loss of the time with their families and the money that could have been used for vacations or investments into REAL businesses. There is a form of abuse that goes on with TEAM that one doesn’t realize until you are out (because that is how a cult works) and these people are still working through it. This is a form of therapy for them. If you don’t like it, move on. I am sure there are many other sites where you can go and tell people to “get over it” and “be positive”….perhaps those who’s lives have been destroyed by tsunamis or abusive ex-spouses or Bernie Madoff.

    But, I am sure that you think that you are much smarter and fiscally “savvy” then the people that post on here, right? Give your head a shake my friend. I took the MonaVIe “Plan” to a couple of financial experts and they screamed PYRAMID scheme. It is a classic commercial cult and so is TEAM.

    Also, who told you that EMV was the best energy drink out there? Let me guess…the “honest” folks at MonaVIe, right? OH….you should TOTALLY believe THAT and that you will become a millionaire if you just work hard and follow the system. Give me a break. And WTF is the comparison with smoking cigarettes and the relative cost of that in comparison? What a ridiculous thing to say. Talk about comparing apples and skyscrapers. There is absolutely no logic to that argument and, if I were you, I would stop using that line as a marketing tool.

    Just so YOU know, we are helping people…ONE person at a time. And we are not asking them for a penny, just to access their critical thinking skills and common sense.

  53. I'm a Lifer permalink
    July 1, 2011 7:51 am

    I repeat…Good is God…Have a nice LIFE people..I’m out.

  54. switch permalink
    July 1, 2011 8:25 am

    Classic! SIGN ME UP!

  55. I Quit ( and glad I Did) permalink
    July 1, 2011 8:25 am

    As I’ve said in the past… another pinhead hawking the Team mantra backpedaling from the blows of truth. Who’s next Owen?

  56. I Quit ( and glad I Did) permalink
    July 1, 2011 8:33 am

    And Humiliated gets a big BOOM GOES THE DYNAMITE!!!!

  57. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 1, 2011 9:40 am

    Humiliated~ That was awesome, so clear and concise! Thank You!

    Lifer~ No doubt you will be ‘out’ it is just a matter of time.One thing I will agree on God is Good, but to USE that as a cop out or as all the other Teamers use it as guilt to meet their agenda, does not make the team good and is a disgrace. The kitchen must have gotten to hot for ya because people were telling you too much truth? Don’t feel too bad that is the way all the other clones react to.

    We could collect every single ‘lifer’- defender that has commented on here and all the other sites and NONE of them can make it through the acid test or stand up to the truth in an open forum.They just simply don’t show back up at least not under the same alias. I have NEVER seen them address the real issues or even humble themselves to admit to the corruption and damages that so many have experienced. It is amazing the denial they display.

  58. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 1, 2011 9:59 am

    Steve~ LOL that is it; the system only works when they get you to a point you DONT think, everything is on autopilot! I couldn’t agree more, I have been recently reminded of some things too, that are pretty telling to the master minds behind this web of deceit and runs through so many paths it is disturbing. The ‘stacking’ that was done in Q/A was at least the person kept their own personals. In MV they are giving them away, which makes no sense based on you get paid off of your personals in many ways as weblieved pointed out in another post, bulk order, team commisions, etc. Another way they are in my opinion actually stealing others bonus’ what little they would get anyway.It blows my mind they self-claim to be such intelligent genius, guru’s. The only thing they are good at is manipulation, and being good cons.

  59. switch permalink
    July 1, 2011 10:09 am

    Well said Speak, and I was going to add that this is a perfect example of what is truly going on. A complete lie told within, all told in the name of god supposedly but in reality behind all the lies and deception, it’s about the almight dollar.

    Looking back, it’s like deja-vu with my old upline.

    Gives me the creeps.

  60. TOD permalink
    July 1, 2011 10:39 am

    Don’t forget that we all felt like I’m a Lifer at one time so we cannot be too hard on him.

    I think it would be interesting to go back through all of the Team Cd’s way back to when they were tapes and see how many of the speakers are no longer with Team. I bet it is more that 50% that are now gone.

  61. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 1, 2011 10:44 am

    Switch & IQ~ So simply said with such impact. Creepy is a good description especially when you have been up close and personal and know what we know and can finally begin to see it clearly, the greed and power is the driving force, for sure. Just as humilated pointed out so clearly is criminal, she has been a great help in so many ways as all of you have and I am truly grateful for your support and patience and the this blog, the self-sacrifice and dedication that all of you and Amthrax has provided. That is true unconditional caring for others. Thanks, it is much needed and cannot put a price tag on the humor and support you all have brought to me!

  62. humiliated permalink
    July 1, 2011 10:45 am

    You disgust me LIfer. Repeating “God is Good” does not give you credibility, nor is it a response to any of the questions asked. ANSWER THE QUESTIONS YOU COWARD! You have come on here name calling & accusing people of things that you can’t prove, nor can you prove any of the statements that you make, so you slither away like a snake, & hide behind your religious shield. Well done.

  63. I Quit ( and glad I Did) permalink
    July 1, 2011 10:46 am

    TOD- I would agree. I can’t verify it though cuz I accidently (wink wink) left all my old tapes in the attic when I sold my house. Darn it.

  64. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 1, 2011 10:48 am

    TOD~HI, yes you are right and I also know that when we were in ‘shutting out’ the ‘negative’ outsiders and ignoring the obvious became second nature. It takes a lot to wake someone up from the slumber. If you took out all the ‘other’ los, it would probably be less than 50%.
    Good to hear from you. 🙂

  65. humiliated permalink
    July 1, 2011 10:53 am

    I agree TOD, but what gets under my skin was literally coming on here and calling everyone negative and saying “wah wah wah” and then saying he/she just wanted a friendly, healthy debated. Bullshit. Lifer wanted to attack and expected everyone to play dead. Lifer could have started the discussion in a tactful manner and it might have been constructive. It is just about good manners and I get frustrated with people that come on here and have no respect for others, but demand respect from us. It is just about decent human interaction, it is not a TEAM, or us against them thing. I guess respect goes out the window when the Team Superiority Complex rears it’s ugly head and I have to remember. that.

  66. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 1, 2011 11:01 am

    I believe it takes the TRUTH and eventually it will penetrate their conscience, and if that doesn’t work then the pain of being in near financial ruin with the overpriced junk then it will eventually leave them with no choice but to continue to bury themselves or file bankruptcy as many have or came very close. 😦
    I don’t know how they can ignore it when the truth is so obviously, and plainly put to them, they really would only have to look at their tree, SERIOUSLY, people are in major denial! And the lies that they have customers is appalling. You can’t count people you sponsored as ‘your customers’,

  67. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 1, 2011 11:15 am

    humiliated~ I agree it has always been, the rules are different for them. This is a common practice in the Team (mis) Leaders techniques.Rules of the law, or asking questions, truthful human interaction or being allowed to point out discrepincies are NOT allowed and they don’t have to play fair. Their RULES are different, period. It is their way or the highway! Laurie W. herself has admitted this many times as one of Orrin’ ‘old’ traits (my way or the highway) but of course was always stated in past tense as if he changed, no he just has honed his manipulation skills by some seriously disturbing information they have read and learned.

  68. Burned Out With MV permalink
    July 1, 2011 11:19 am

    Guess the silence answered my question, that guy is losing his ass with this 🙂

  69. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 1, 2011 11:22 am

    And I should state they practice.

  70. switch permalink
    July 1, 2011 11:25 am

    “Seems like just all bad blood with the Amway crap if you ask me….”

    I was going to ask him to go into details on this. Obviously, he knows some facts that maybe he’d like to share. He brought it up correct? “Bad blood”…ew, sounds juicy to me. (Yes, I know what happened.) But what’s interesting is how they love to call them opinions when supposedly spelling out the truth/history behind it all…..please note, I believe it was one of the first things that, “the other guy” said in his very first post.

    Talk about shooting yourself in the foot.

  71. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 1, 2011 12:56 pm

    Just one last thing for you lifer, you say: “I’m not holding a gun to people’s head and telling them they have to get in. FREEDDOM of Choice is Number ONE in my book.”

    There is no need for guns in the game of deception, and mind control, it is done slowly through changing your beliefs, malipulation and deception; to suit the needs of the agenda and capture you for their selfish reasons of power and greed. If you have shown the plan once or gone to a couple of seminars, you should know this you are repeating exactly what you have heard and use yourself to get someone started. It really doesn’t matter what you say, they teach you deceptive techniques, how to answer a question with asking a question, and all the other ‘stop thinking’ techniques that cults use to get others off the ‘logical’ thinking onto believing what you say. If you read about cult leaders such as Jim Jones and others you will find none of them used guns on their brainwashed victims.

    If freedom of choice is your number one in your book, then you are with the wrong group of people.That is our point that you fail to see. They will eventually strip you of that. They control absolute everything, you may think you are making your own choices but you will not make it in the team by making your own choices, you have to conform for a lot of reasons people have told you, edification, you have to prove you are ‘all in’ and completely loyal to get anywhere etc.We speak out and have shared our experiences because we have compassion and don’t want others to have to suffer or live the regrets we have had to.

    If you are truly happy with what you are doing then fire on, but we know you will be hurting others in the process and that is not acceptable. It is quite blantanly the opposite, the freedom of choice you believe you have, will turn into the slavery, but you chose not to see that those speaking on here have had YEARS of experience and big ‘success’ in the team as you would think of as ‘success’, we do have repeated told others that exact point.

    This has been the most freeing to speak the truth, you of all people should understand that if what you say about being an alcoholic is true. AA is free or for a very small donations if you have it to pay for room, correct? Those people have everything in common with you and their motives are pure in they are there to help each other. They are not their to take your money. One thing strickingly odd; 2 conclusions can be drawn; is many people have come here and other sites and have said their were alcoholic/drug addictics and the ‘team’ has someone saved them from their addiction. I would agree that support and encouragement is much needed to stay clean and sober, I have someone very close to me that has suffered with addiction most of their life. YOU make the decision daily to stay sober, correct; and usually have a ‘sponsor’ who has been there for you, then AA to help?

    Back to the conclusions, either the team is soliciting AA/NA as prospects, or a lot of them are falling prey, or some people are lying to make the system sound like a miracle and the only thing keeping others clean and sober. Just my opinion but I find it very odd so many people have repeated that same thing, perhaps it is easy to fall into the trap of the false fascade the team entices with; that everyone is so accepting and nice. The truth of the matter is that lasts for a couple of weeks then you will be expected to stand on your own and get to work or they will not have time for you. Sure they will; to your face and the seminars ‘appear’ that they care about you, but trust me, the leaders have moved on from you if you haven’t started performing, and going to everything.

    We have experienced and seen for many, many years that those who will hold you back by needing true friendship will be lost in their needs and will be shuffled to the side. My point is if anyone is looking to fill the need for encouragement and support, you will not receive the depth you are looking for, and is dangerous to rely on others.Go to a church, or what ever your beliefs, AA/NA sponsors and groups, or just a great friend will be way more helpful to you in the long run. You will feel betrayed when you figure out the soul reason they need you is for ticket sales, system, and you to continue to buy not for your benefit but theirs not the other way around trying to serve your needs.

  72. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 1, 2011 7:10 pm

    Switch you are right. Just like ‘The Wave’ perfectly displayed the ‘bad blood’ and history lessons from that we must all learn from! Too bad their weren’t enough icon’s share the chant, lol :] Scary -“-

  73. outside looking in permalink
    July 2, 2011 5:53 pm

    Ya’all might be a bit surprised at the end of July. Just sayin’.

  74. July 2, 2011 6:11 pm

    Surprised in what way? Good or bad from an ex-TEAM, critics point of view?

  75. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 3, 2011 1:05 am

    Amthrax, The only ‘surprise’ would be to see justice served for all, for the unethical, illegal, and immoral damages done. Other than that; the ‘surprised’ factor; that element was gone years ago when the truth had to be faced to all the shenanigans they did. 🙂

  76. aurora permalink
    July 3, 2011 5:02 am

    This commenter requested that her comments be removed from this site.

  77. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 3, 2011 1:58 pm

    Hey Aurora~ It is great to see you comment! 🙂 You have been a tremendous support and even though you weren’t a part of the team, it is all in the same cult system we have all experienced. Not a lot of difference. Keep visiting! 🙂

    Amthrax~ I should have said it would be a plesant ‘surprise’ to see the Criminal Justice System, IRS, FTC, etc.. bring the justice and to the public for the whole world to see!
    That will not just be pleasant but justified and a celebration to see true justice served! 🙂

  78. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 3, 2011 3:58 pm

    HAPPY 4TH TO ALL YOU INDEPENDENT THINKERS! FEELS GREAT TO BE FREE AND AM GRATEFUL FOR WHAT THE 4TH REPRESENTS FOR ALL!!! 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

  79. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 3, 2011 5:31 pm

    Amthrax ~

    Do you think this has anything to do with the ‘surprise’? Found this on Juicescam site from, one of the commentors. Oh, how the team hates the truth and bad press. Same thing happened when they jumped ship/ got booted, right before all the news with all the lawsuits and trouble in the UK with Q/Amway. Just makes you wonder doesn’t it, that they been hyping the L.I.F.E. coach/training, with its new name and judging by what others on team are promoting, seems like they are trying to go solo? They wouldn’t be trying to run from the bad press and leave in the nick of time again, would they? Hmmm….? Not sure but found this very interesting. Pretty sure PC gets news before everyone else. I copied and pasted this so am not sure it will work for the live link.

    Distributors of MonaVie Malaysia are suing MonaVie!

    Check out the link above.

  80. July 3, 2011 6:30 pm

    I don’t think this lawsuit has anything to do with the surprise, but who knows. I think the way it’s going to pan it is like this: “MonaVie is great… we’ll continue to drink the juice. But… we’ve come to realize that our strength in TEAM is the way we help people become better in their lives. So, we’re going to start selling more of these life coaching products, and you can sell them for a profit too!” That’s my guess… we’ll all find out in a few weeks!

  81. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 3, 2011 7:15 pm

    LOL what would be the ‘surprise’ then? 🙂

  82. outside looking in permalink
    July 3, 2011 7:16 pm

    BTW, Amthrax I’m a huge fan.

  83. webelieved permalink
    July 4, 2011 7:01 am

    Outside Looking In-
    Suprise? Let me guess……. Team and Orrin are going to lower the bar so they can break new levels on Team for the major? It’s all about building belief right. Change the requirements, or the way they count teams for profit sharing, system and ticket counts, for recognition to make it look like you are growing and breaking new levels? Just a hunch! Or how about buying your way to your rank by volume loading? We have seen it all and NOTHING SUPRISES US. You newbies believe whatever you see and hear to be true at face value, and I used to be the same way until I could think again! There always needs to be recognition for the major, don’t you know! I also know in my experience since Team has gotten into Mv, they will resort to any tactic, to make it appear there is a lot of growth. Shame on them!
    Can’t wait to see the SHOW at the end of the month! I am sure PC, Guzzardo, Brady, Marks and Woodward are running around like crazy, doing meetings this month to promote the majors, to sell seminar tickets, to get their tens of thousands, maybe hundreds of thousands $$$$ out of unsespecting people’s pockets in ticket and tools sales all under the talk of changing the country! LOL

  84. webelieved permalink
    July 4, 2011 7:04 am

    Once again I am so glad I am no longer part of the deception! 🙂

  85. webelieved permalink
    July 4, 2011 7:25 am

    Im a Lifer may be really embarassed that he picked that name in a few years! I guess he can’t take the heat of the truth! How sad when you are so brainwashed you cannot see the truth. I pray that God will bring him freedom of mind, so he can think clearly. Amazing they cannot even admit what they said in black and white!
    Humiliated- Great Post! You are so clear! That guy was talking in circles! Team definitly breeds Us vs them mentality. Critics are losers and negative, we are the enemy! In my experience you need to either have their opinion or better yet NO OPINION, else you be silenced! No healthy debate allowed and when they cannot win, they will attack your character!

  86. webelieved permalink
    July 4, 2011 8:32 am

    Orrin- Real leaders sink or swim on the truth! Tell them the truth! |Tell them you came from another mlm, that you built for years, decades? Tell them what deal you got from Dallin. Tell them you inherited thousands of distributors that you did not build like Randy Haugen, Billy Florence and their teams! Tell them you did not earn it in MV. Tell them there are other systems to chose from in MV. Tell them how you really are breaking pins. Tell them some of your leaders were buying thousand dollar orders and bribing people to go on a system to break new pin levels up the ranks in MV. Disclose that leaders are getting paid for selling the system up front. Tell them that even though you preach positive, you really are negative in secret, bashing others character and slandering them with the wisper campaigns. Tell them to call the leaders who left and find out on their own, without your tainted lies. Tell them you and other PC took people’s teams without so much as a phone call after promising them for years passive, residual income and YOU know they did the work, some for decades! Tell them you will blame it on the downline person, solicited to write the letters by your PC. Tell them you did that to cover your own arss and when it comes down to it, you will let the responsibility rest on their shoulders. Tell them you do not practice what you preach from stage! Tell them up front , you gave system counts and ticket counts and mv teams to some of your favorites to make it appear they were breaking new levels in the TEAM and MV. Tell them how you didn’t care if the little guy was skipped over in the registration process or lost their team because you needed to hit your pin level. Tell them how MV changed the pay structure and lowered the requirements for personals this past year or so, so it appeared people were breaking new pins when really nothing changed. Tell them some people speaking really had their businesses built by someone else that you stole from! Tell them that Pastor Dickie and his whole family has left the Team including ceo and attorney. You know , the great man of God, the Pastor you edified and called your mentor and sold his cds and now I am sure pretend doesn’t exist.
    IN MY EXPERIENCE, YOUR LEADERS CANNOT STAND ON THE TRUTH BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT REAL LEADERS, THEY ARE FOLLOWERS!
    YOU ORRIN, ARE A COWARD, A THEIF AND A GREAT DECIEVER!
    God knows the truth of all you and others have done, lied about, purposely withheld information, or turned a blind eye to,
    all in the name of your precious silver, pride and power !
    Shame on you all!
    I would rather be a begger on the street, then associate with liars like you!

  87. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 4, 2011 8:36 am

    Webelieved~Surprise, would this be nothing has changed, it is the same thing they have always done, just anounce, explain, and promote equals hype, as if there is something new? LOL

    Well, I find it funny, they have said this for close to a couple of decades. There have been changes no doubt, like leaving Amway because it was a ‘pyramid scheme’ with hopelessly overpriced products, then to MV and how was this different again. My memory just can’t recall anything different there. Pay structure is a little different but everyone I have ever talked to have said their prices are too high too. So can you help me out and let me know what the surprise is, I am failing to see anything different at all?

  88. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 4, 2011 8:41 am

    Webelieved~
    Wowee! Boom goes the Dynamite! Now that would be some transparency, wouldn’t it? 🙂

  89. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 4, 2011 2:51 pm

    Webelieved~ Just a few of your comments that I have been pondering :):

    ” Or how about buying your way to your rank by volume loading?Tell them some of your leaders were buying thousand dollar orders and bribing people to go on a system to break new pin levels up the ranks in MV. Tell them up front , you gave system counts and ticket counts and mv teams to some of your favorites to make it appear they were breaking new levels in the TEAM and MV. Change the requirements, or the way they count teams for profit sharing, system and ticket counts, for recognition to make it look like you are growing and breaking new levels?”

    Oh my, what a deceptive disgrace; would this be a few ways they ‘fake it’…faker rankers!
    That would be a great team name; ‘faker ranker’, the wavers! LHOL 🙂
    Besides stealing, cheating, and manipulating peoples groups and personals during registration? Do you suppose they buy people’s tickets and system too, some I bet would even be phantom tickets?
    Pretty much set them up with some freebies! What happened to EARN IT? Did they take that CD out of the system, probably not that would be for those who ‘ain’t gotta clue’ and expected to work like a dog and burn out and lose all their family and friends.

    Another one of those the ‘ends justifies the means’ regardless if it is moral, legal or ethical.
    I think I am staring to get it, this must be what they meant by; ‘fake it til you make it’.
    I always wondered what that meant! 🙂 LHOL

    Guess it doesn’t matter if anything is genuine in a dictatorship, that would defeat its purpose,it is always about how we can control and fake you out! I am sooo with ya on thrilled to be out and away from the deception! 🙂

  90. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 4, 2011 10:32 pm

    outside looking in on~Can you share some more with us? Hope you are speaking from a perspective that would make a nice suprise from a standpoint on justice being served! 🙂

    Seriously, I think this is going to be a GREAT BOOK I am still in the process of reading, but it is a free download and have had it for quite a while as another book to read. I am glad I started. It is going to be another WORTH the read and needs to go VIRAL, this could help many others not have to experience what we did! So you can all go to this website and download it for FREE and the tell others, one person @ a time, lol! You know the best advertising is ‘word of mouth’ 🙂

    http://www.mlm-thetruth.com/

    Amthrax ~ maybe you would be so kind to have this as an added link too? 🙂 Thanks in advance! 🙂

  91. July 5, 2011 1:49 am

    I added a link to MLM Truth on my blogroll sidebar on the right.

  92. I'm a Lifer permalink
    July 5, 2011 5:42 am

    Sad that y’all have to be so cynical toward life. I’m a coward, eh? I figured you would be making comments about my character. If you are going to comment on my character simply because of the choices I make in my life, why should I participate in any kind of debate with you all. Amthrax, as the leader of this group, I would think you should advise your posters to treat people with decency and respect. I am NOT a coward…You don’t even know me and the life I lead so before you starting slamming ones character, I would think you would want to get to know a person first. A person isn’t all about the profession they participate in. All of you obviously had a bad experience with TEAM in some way shape or form. But Who Made those choices? You did. This weekend, I shared the same freedoms as all of you. I had cook-outs and went to firework. Spent a lot of quality time with good friends and family. You act like I don’t have freedom just because I’m a part of Team….but here I am enjoying my life, thinking for myself just like all of you. We all have freedom and our right to free speech. So before you start accusing me of not being able to think for myself, get a clue. I’m here…I’m living…I’m thinking for MYSELF. I have as much Independence as ALL of You!! I’m sorry but I love the Monavie product and I Love the books and materials. Why does this make me such an awful person? Why does this make me a coward? And Yes, I can go to Borders or Amazon, or any place to buy personal development books….but Will I?? Getting them delivered to my door gives me the ability to say, “Yes, I need to work on myself and better myself”. In the time I’ve been with TEAM, my life has changed and become better only because of the effort I have put into this. And No One, No One, No One, has held a gun to my head and told me I HAVE to do this. So go ahead, call me a coward or someone who talks in circles, etc. etc. etc…but I know better…..
    Take care..and peace to all.

  93. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 5, 2011 8:15 am

    Lifer~there you go again twisting it up. You were NOT called a ‘coward’ because of ‘your choices’ but because you DIDN’T ANSWER the questions. So everthing that you accuse, doesn’t even apply. You can ‘choose’ to do whatever you want, this is a free country and freedom of speach, we are here not for you and as stated before. so fire on pal but we know you are hurting others in your pursuit of ‘profit-your choices’ and again that is unacceptable.

    YOU say;” All of you obviously had a bad experience with TEAM in some way shape or form. But Who Made those choices? You did.”
    What? Where did you pull that pile of horse dung from? We DID NOT chose for a bunch of con’s to steal, cheat, and lie and manipulate everyone’s groups and personal then do unethical, immoral and illegal shenanigans by their own choice. That responsiblity lies on the corrupt leaders who mastered and carried out that plan. We Chose to Leave, that was our choice.If you are robbed, would this be your choice? Or what if you were part of Bernie Madoffs rip off, do you think it was the victims’ choice’ to have him con them?

    You can ‘love’ whatever you ‘chose’ but don’t expect good people to stand back and watch others be damaged. Already explained to you there is no need for guns, go do your homework.

  94. switch permalink
    July 5, 2011 10:13 am

    Lifer-
    So, let me get this straight….. people here have had bad experiences with team and mona vie and you expect them to keep their silence about that???? Are the lifers the only ones who are awarded with freedom of speech, here?

    “All of you obviously had a bad experience with TEAM in some way shape or form. But Who Made those choices? You did.”

    WHAT?????????? Have you even been reading up on who’s said what here?

    If you’re a part of something special like you imply here, finish the debate instead of ignoring facts that you’ll have to face up the road.

    Looking forward to it.

  95. Dorothy permalink
    July 5, 2011 4:04 pm

    This commenter requested that her comments be removed from this site.

  96. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 5, 2011 9:18 pm

    This is a book that Orrin has read and recommened to a very selected few and just the first law. We will give you time to absorb that then stay tuned. For all you who think you are ‘free thinkers’.
    Law 1

    Never Outshine the Master

    Always make those above you feel comfortably superior. In your desire to please or impress them, do not go too far in displaying your talents or you might accomplish the opposite – inspire fear and insecurity. Make your masters appear more brilliant than they are and you will attain the heights of power.

    Can you figure out who applies the #1 law, that has been studied and read by the one and only? This should give those ‘free willed, with their free choices’ and inside look at how free and manipulated they really are. 🙂 ‘Ain’t gotta clue how controlled and manilpulated you all are.

  97. Speak Your Truth permalink
    July 6, 2011 12:10 am

    Thanks a bunch Amthrax for all you do! 🙂

  98. aurora permalink
    July 6, 2011 4:33 am

    This commenter requested that her comments be removed from this site.

  99. A H***** Freak permalink
    February 24, 2012 1:45 pm

    I’ve been introduced to the TEAM twice. The first was Mona-Vie two years ago, which I felt a strong dis-interest after going to a seminar. I was introduced to the LIFE system back in November 2011 but immediately felt awkward, and I still feel awkward to this day about the way the information was presented, and they never told me how I would begin the “business”. I started LIFE last week but I just really WANT OUT. I have never felt this uneasy, this lenghty, in my life.

    I cannot understand the following:
    >Paying for YOUR own ticket to go to a TEAM convention
    >Paying a fee JUST to start employment (when TEAM will counter this excuse and say that small business owners pay a fee and you ARE a small business owner)
    >Paying for CDs that I may not have anymore use for because NO ONE listens to CDs anymore

    The information I am currently gaining from the CDs, they make me think about the many ways I can improve my life, and really opened up my mind.

    However I argue that THIS IS THE INFORMATION AGE and to me, information=data that can freely go on the Internet. WHY DOESN’T THE TEAM DISTRIBUTE THESE RECORDINGS ON ITUNES OR ZUNE FOR FREE while THEY MAKE THE BIG BUCKS AT SEMINARS ALREADY?!?!?!

    I agree with the saying that you TRULY make money IF and ONLY IF you understand the system THE WAY MR. WOODWARD understands it.

    I understand that everyone needs an education. However, having an education in a higher education institution AT LEAST ensures your ability to graduate

    I have thought about for years about the “what-ifs” and the “big picture” about everything in life. These thought will not allow me to work for TEAM because I second-guess myself to the “big picture” and “what-ifs” ALL the time.

    I only make money for the TEAM when I encourage people join the TEAM. As far as I see it, those who recruit me make money OFF of me, I make money off those who I recruit, but the TEAM Management makes money off of ME.

    I find it odd that the system implies that you make more money when you recruit more people. If the whole world decided to join the TEAM, there would be NO ONE LEFT because the whole world already knows each other on TEAM! LET’S THINK OF IT THAT WAY!!!

    I already know that TEAM members are “brainwashed” to counter-argue my thoughts with, but many others will understand my views and agree with me in the end. Their counter-arguments, however cannot apply to me because of my sophisticated way of thinking.

    I already pay $150/month for Jiu-Jitsu and I can actually learn and-relearn how to defend myself and help me become mentally stable EVERY NIGHT, knowing that I am safe, able to sleep well, knowing well I can most likely defend myself when someone tries to attack me. Does TEAM teach Martial Arts as part of their “Fitness”? NO!

    Plus, why get me to believe that when I retire at age 65, I get the implication that I burn through my retirement quickly? What if I don’t WANT to retire at 65? What if I DO WANT to keep working till the day I die? Not everyone wants to make money doing nothing!

    I believe that in a relationship, both parties HAVE TO fight for and be financially stable (by going to work) in a relationship. I can’t work and fight for her love if she isn’t doing the same for mine.

    Yes, life is a learning process. Thanks to the Internet however, LEARNING PROCESS TOOLS can be obtained for FREE. FREE!

    If TEAM is right and I am wrong, that’s the chance that I AM WILLING TO TAKE. I love the materials, and I like the people that are with TEAM, but I dislike your recruiting procedures and business methods. Expect a resignation in the next few weeks, from the date of this post.

    Much love!! ❤ ❤

    [Editor’s note: Changed handle, which may be objectionable to some]

  100. ExAmbot permalink
    February 25, 2012 2:45 pm

    @A H*****

    Clearly your $150 expenditure per month has been put to very good use. You have critically thought and raised pointed questions from independent thinking, a bane of TEAM and all of pretend MLM “industry”. Good job. There are better things to do in life than be an MLM scam artist.

    And how about that fitness question. Thanks for clarifying that team’s fitness exists in word only, equals deception. Very smart observation!

    To surmise MLMs and their MOs (motivation orgs) are populated by two types of people – A.) the few milkers and B.) those who get milked, the vast majority, the 99%+ who don’t make $$ in mlm. Everything is implemented to maximize the milking opportunities for the milkers for as long is possible before the victim quits, buy CD’s, books, pay for meetings, etc, nothing for free. To milking your $150 p/m is a very very lucrative business to them, just multiply it by a few thousands more who are inevitably in the B group and will never ever, by design, get to the A group.

  101. TruthSeeker permalink
    February 25, 2012 3:02 pm

    @AH*** You Wrote, “I agree with the saying that you TRULY make money IF and ONLY IF you understand the system THE WAY MR. WOODWARD understands it.” WRONG!

    Unfortunately “understanding” the system is not a prerequisite to making money because there are literally a whole plethora of other circumstances that will determine whether you earn or not. MR. WAYWARD and the PC will hand pick you and position you to make money if you fall into their good graces, and toe the proverbial line.

Trackbacks

  1. MonaVie MVP – Training For International Distributors « AMTHRAX

Leave a Reply. Because your thoughtful opinions are valued, you are encouraged to add a comment to this discussion. Don't be offended if your comments are edited for clarity or to keep out questionable matters. Off-topic and inflammatory comments may be deleted. Comments on this website are the sole responsibility of their writers. The accuracy, completeness, veracity, honesty, exactitude, factuality and politeness of comments are not guaranteed.

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s

%d bloggers like this: